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Forums > Living in Kunming > Renouncing Child's citizenship

For questions or concerns regarding passports, dual nationality, and how to exit/enter china for the child, simply verify the process with the ultimate and definitive source on these matters - the exit/entry office on tuodeng road. You'll need to immediately escalate to a supervisor as the clerks only know how to do visa application intake. If a clerk tries to answer - don't believe them. It's exceedingly rare they would be familiar with such things and they're most probably making things up, to your ultimate detriment.

The supervisor will most probably call the airport exit/entry counterpart to verify and confirm the process and voila - you're good to go.

That's the way it works. There is no law broken, as long as you're legally traveling with your child.

As for an adult traveling on dual passports - you may also want to take the opportunity to ask the chinese passport agency entry/exit officer (NOT the front desk clerks) their policies and procedures for adults, as I would think you'd want to eventually naturalize your wife, but she'd probably want to retain her chinese passport for travel.

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Forums > Living in Kunming > Renouncing Child's citizenship

@ocean
As noted above, For entry/exit China, use the child's Chinese passport.

On that note, redjon777 says the process I provided won't work for his particular situation, so regrets.

Renunciation of citizenship seemed rather drastic, so I'd hoped an alternative solution would prove feasible. Regrets.

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Forums > Living in Kunming > Renouncing Child's citizenship

@ocean
Simply show the child's UK passport when exiting China, if this issue arises. As long as you're traveling with the birth mother OR you have a document permitting you to transport the child as legal guardian (or worst case, a death certificate), this should not be an issue.

If you're concerned about exiting China on a Chinese passport without a destination visa - simply visit the Chinese ENTRY/EXIT office and ask the officer for advice. They will probably not be familiar with these special entry/exit procedures and will need to escalate the question to their supervisor.

Beware of staff making up stupid rules because they don't know the answer. The supervisor will know the correct policy and procedure. Make sure you get his name, badge number, and phone number (ask for it - don't just write it down) and ask politely if the exit office can call him to confirm, if you have problems exiting.

Front desk staff will probably panic if you ask if you can record their badge number and cite them as a reference at the airport entry/exit gates.

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Forums > Living in Kunming > Renouncing Child's citizenship

@redjon
Many people travel with dual citizenship and dual passports. It is not illegal and rather typical in the EU, Canada, Australia, and especially Hong Kong, and becoming more frequent in China - especially since China somewhat relaxed its one-child policy for the Han-race minority (other recognized and designated minorities in China are not restricted by the one-child policy).

These are the simple steps to traveling with dual nationality passports. This assumes your child has both a Chinese AND a UK passport already, as I'm not familiar with entering / exiting China without a passport, even for babies.

ENTRY/EXIT CHINA
Upon entry/exit China, use China travel documents.

ENTRY/EXIT UK
Upon entry/exit UK, use your UK travel documents.

Rarely do immigration officials check WHERE you came from if you use that country's passport. If you're asked, just present the other passport, which shows entry/exit stamps. As you're traveling with a child on your UK passport and your child's Chinese passport, you should expect them to scrutinize both the entry and exit carefully, because of the issues of child trafficking and child kidnapping. If the immigration officer asks where you came from and the passport has no record of that exit - you'll need to show the second passport for proof.

If asked why you're entering the country with that country's passport - just tell them it's the law for dual citizenship holders.

There is nothing illegal about traveling with dual nationality passports, unless one of your home countries specifically has laws against that. It MAY raise eyebrows in third world countries (too many spy movies), but in most developed countries - this is not unusual; not pervasive, but not unusual.

As long as you're forthcoming in your answers - you should have no issues traveling with your child.

FYI - in the USA - even if/when our child is/was a baby, we were required to secure children's passports when traveling.

Children's passports expire every FIVE (5) years and the USA recently stopped its program of "adding pages" to passports, so we always get the "extra pages" passports, at no additional cost (adding pages used to cost us USD 80+, while a new passport was USD 105).

Finally - and not related to this thread - if your child was born in a foreign country and you secured a US Consulate/Embassy Report of Birth Abroad as a "birth certificate" AND you bring your kids to China under the US passport - the US State Department will NOT authenticate your children's birth certificates.

If you have this issue, PM me and I'll tell you how to legally resolve this issue, bypassing the US State Department's bizarre policy (since 2012). If more than one person PM's me - I'll just start another thread.

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Forums > Living in Kunming > English Teaching Jobs in Classifieds

@octobersky
PUBLIC EMAILS VS CORPORATE DOMAIN NAMES
Most SME's (small to medium enterprises) in China use public domain emails in-country, because of the revolving firewall. Once a domain name is blocked or "restricted", it's a time consuming process to have your domain name whitelisted - meanwhile no emails are coming in or going out without the VPN - which seems to be a game of whack-a-mole.

Losing access to your email is utterly unacceptable in today's high speed digital age. Most campus (corporate, governmental, and academic) email systems and IT systems in general are poorly managed, poorly staffed, poorly trained, with generally abysmal infrastructure. I believe I'm being generous with my praise.

WORKING IN CHINA
I highly recommend you try to find employment with an established firm FIRST. There's another concurrent string about working at the Yunnan University of Finance and Economics, but the financial issues there are rather nominal (aside from the 3 month lapse in salary).

A mainline organization, such as a university, is much less prone to playing games with its foreign faculty as they tend to process boatloads of foreign faculty and students annually.

Smaller private organizations would be more susceptible to fleecing or bait and switch tactics.

The larger institutions typically pay sub-par - but it's generally stable and reliable AND will expose you to the pseudo-official way of doing business and working in China, so you'll be able to sniff out questionable business practices with the privately owned enterprises.

This will give you a more stable base from which to "expand your horizons".

For a list of teaching institutions in Yunnan, just search wikipedia for "list of universities in Yunnan" (or kunming), then try to find each university's Foreign Affairs Office (FAO) to sell yourself.

FOREIGN EXPERT DESIGNATION
Usually, the academic institution will register you as a "foreign expert". This process has become increasingly demanding and rigid, to comply with the rest of China. I've heard that Yunnan is part of a 12-city pilot - which usually means new process, new staff, and SNAFU FUBAR experiences as you navigate through this new layer of frustrating and bewildering administerium.

Your mileage may vary (YMMV).

Good luck and happy hunting!

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Yereth
I was thinking that gokm could maybe get the Kunming Tourism Dept and the KM Metro et al to pay for a professionally illustrated bilingual PDF map and maybe start a series of web articles and videos on things to do and see (and eat) at each station - aside from the major tourism venues.

NHK (Japan) did this about 20 years ago - very popular and interesting series - inspires people to get out, socialize (when it's safe) and support local businesses...or not.

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Grace
The referenced map was an ANCIENT planning map...hence the hint hint hint hint to the gokm staff - when they have budget and absolutely nothing better to do with their time...

Yereth's map is great as a geographic index - but most high density subway maps (Beijing, Tokyo) go for the symbolic stations shown in the ancient picture I referenced. These things are great as either screensavers, desktop wallpapers, or mobile phone pictures (screensavers, wallpapers) for those who commute within the bellies of these steel dragons.

I used to carry around subway maps on small plastic cards (doubled as my prepaid card) when exploring these cities. Each station had uniquely popular venues for both tourists and long-term locals alike (popular eateries, shopping boutiques, etc).

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Fuxian Lake is a major vigorously and rigorously protected potable (drinkable) water source. It's host to a plethora of fresh water food, BBQs and the Hilton Hotel overlooks the lake. Behind the Hilton is a rather large collection of villas (HK style), many with basements, garage (not necessarily connected to your home though), and lap pools, if the lake is too far to walk (it's about 1-2km away).

The lake surroundings are a future development site for Yuxi City, so should be interesting to see how the city develops, while complying with the national protection of water resources.

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Took the family here to stroll around and there's a LOT of walking. Many of the stores appear closed, but the bar street nestled inside seems quite well populated.

We chose the Japanese restaurant near the entrance (there are many entrances). The food and service was quite acceptable - from the fruit salad, tuna salad, curry pork cutlet, and the ubiquitous California Sush Rolls (you can buy the small size or the large size).

It rained a little while we were there, which helped drench the heat and humidity. When the sun came out - it was HOT.

If you're lucky, you'll occasionally see people (usually women) wearing minority clothing being photographed by professional photographers. There's also a small photographer's store where you can rent various ethnic clothing and have professional pictures taken (maybe the two are related...now that I think about it).

There's also the ubiquitous game centers (shooting galleries etc) for the kids and unaccompanied teenagers.

It seems the most popular venues were the prolific food courts - but that's probably related to it being lunchtime when we visited. The place is clean and plenty of antiqued door fronts (the wood panels) for those photo shoots.

Capping off the visit, one must of course take pictures on the bridges crossing the lily ponds and the landmark temple spire. We didn't make it to the surrounding temples. Maybe next time.

Transportation is everywhere - but make sure you have your mobile phone ride share app working, just in case you hit rush hour.

Again - for now - it seems many vendors were closed - but I'm positive that'll change again as the economy begins to rebound.

Excellent way to spend a half day as opposed to the kids faces glued to their mobile devices...fresh air, good food, plenty of people watching, and walking...walking...walking...

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Took the family here a few days ago. Wonderful place to go walking with lots of snack & drink kiosks (along with chairs and tables) to rest frequently. This zoo is similar to most other large open air zoos with reasonably spacious enclosures. This place is HUGE so be prepared for a LOT of walking. Consider wearing sensible hiking or walking shoes. Your feet will be grateful.

Entrance fees when we went still cny100 for adults and kids cny70. Feeding the animals at the managed venues - cny30 per site...per child. Monkeys can be fed by tossing carrots and sliced apples into their enclosure - which is good. Monkeys famous for flash mobbing. Can be terrifying for kids (and adults). Even in the enclosures, you can clearly see they're territorial and aggressive. Bullying is displayed frequently enough for teaching moments for the kids (cuz there are monkeys in all schools everywhere in the world).

MOST people bring their own food and drink, as the kiosks are quite expensive. Example a cny5 drink outside is cny10 in the zoo, so expect most everything to be twice as expensive. I had a bbq chick drumstick (leg?) for cny25...ouch.

Bring carrots. LOTS of carrots. The zoo has several managed (paid) and unmanaged petting areas for most semi-domesticated animals, such as the Alpacas (seriously cute), deer, giraffes (ok...you can feed the giraffes on an elevated platform, but probably difficult to "pat" the animals. It's kind of spectacular to actually see giraffes face to face - these animals are simply vertigo inducing huge and tall.

The seal show was nice - typical of seal shows everywhere. Seals are kind of like the dogs of the sea. Friendly and ravenous appetites so easily trainable.

Lots of cheap touristy souvenirs to buy the for the kiddies (and relatives kids).

HIGHLY recommend taking the bus tour - they basically zoom around picking up and dropping off customers (they check your e-ticket at every pickup site) at entrances and exits to walking enclosures. They'll drop you off at roughly 15 minute walking sites. NO need to rush and you can grab ANY bus upon emerging from the walking enclosure sites.

Of course, the ultimate attraction always the lion and tiger exhibits at the top of the mountain.

Bring a fan. It gets hot. We were fortunate as the sky was mostly overcast so the temperature was generally cool, but heated up almost instantly whenever the sun peeked out of the clouds.

Bring LOTS of water. Most veteran tourists have their own liter bottles of water. Bring your own umbrella. When the sun comes out - it's HOT. Bring a wide brimmed hat if you're into comfort over vanity. SUNTAN LOTION never goes astray.

Aside from that - typical Chinese group site with everyone rushing the buses and ticket counters. Not so much rushing for the food venues, so seems the elevated prices keep that comfortably in check.

All in all - GREAT place to take the kiddies (or a date if you both know you're into each other - cuz you'll be spending an entire day together). The Outdoor Zoo seems exceptionally well designed with plenty of both managed and unmanaged (eg walking deer along the roadside and the stroll through the peacock "garden").

Easy cab or shared ride out and back. Taxis aplenty when you're ready to leave (just walk past the parking lot gate - they'll be waiting for you). You should consider dining out or delivery at the end of the day.

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Took the kiddies here again.

1. It's FREE.
2. NO knives, lighters, sharp objects, etc. There's a place in front to check bags, luggage (if you're traveling), etc - but the exit is in the rear of the monolithic building, so it's a bit of a hike to walk back around to the checked storage area (it's also FREE).

THIRD FLOOR
We went straight to the third floor - History and artifacts of Yunnan (mostly). Rich history - lots of original sculptures etc removed from grottoes and displayed in the museum. Lots of English language titles and occasionally some explanatory text in English.

SECOND FLOOR
This is the evolution floor with lots of petrified artifacts - sea life mostly, lots of recreations of animals and environments from pre-man times.

There are coffee shops and dining areas on the first floor and drink vending machines on the second and third floors. The place is HUGE so a great place to take the kiddies and walk around until they're tired. They'll probably enjoy the dinosaur exhibit on the second floor the most. Wait a few minutes and the dinosaurs will roar and move their heads and maybe pretend to chew (open and close their maws).

PLENTY of parking and unfortunately NOT close to any subway station, so you'll have to grab a cab or rideshare but seems taxis and transportation are aplenty in the city and surrounding environs.

And...it's FREE for now. Museum closes at 5pm so make sure you leave by 430-445 so you can hike back to the storage area if you checked anything in as they also close at 5pm.

Enjoy!

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This is a great place to walk around and generally kill time while shopping for nothing in particular. Nearby is the Paulaner Brewhouse for super fantastic food, coffee and drinks, outdoor patio dining or just hanging and people watching.