"I have no experience of other Asian countries or the Americas so I can't compare it with those regions."

Maybe I should quit my job and have a stab at a Burmese work visa then head off to Argentina for a job before I comment on here. Is that your point? If not, then what is?

Thinking on though, I have experience of 3 Asian countries work visas, including China, so I'll retract my statement about no Asian visa experience.

when i read napoleons posts, i can't help but see another blind eyed american, just off the boat. no offense to all american's out there. you guys are cool!

so much nonsense and inaccurate mumble.

have you ever tried to open a joint venture or other businesses here in China?
it's everything but easy and you basically have to give all your ideas, and company secrets away, for free and almost literally have no rights compared to your chinese partner.

with proper documentation and if needed in that country, pretty much all of china's neighbors have a faster and easier work visa application process. and in some non socialist countries, you even have rights...imagine that...

china needs so many expats(mostly for all the wrong reasons)...and especially teachers. it's a crappy deadend job in china and not very well paid. that's why china will always need expats for all sorts of jobs. coz they still have not worked out how the HR market works.

or coz many local talents are just plain incompetent.

i confirm all non napoleon statements above.
you can get in the country with different visa but you are not allowed to work.

many schools lie about their visa situation, or register you as anything but a teacher,also illegal. plus, even in utopian wonderland china, you are the one to get busted(fined and deported and blacklisted), if your boss registered you, as a consultant or such, even though the school is responsible, you will be the one getting in trouble. so make sure you have the right visa for your purpose of stay.

my advise make sure you have a work visa procured by the school before you set foot into china. focus on universities, because they are most def licensed to hire you.

When I read Dudsons posts I don't imagine but know for sure he is sitting in a dark room feeling sorry for himself.

When I have applied for visas before I have had to bring apostilles signed by solicitors in my country AND the country I planned to work in, even though I had never been there before. On one occasion I could only apply in Brussels Belgium for Eritrea, a country in Africa. On another I had to get a medical certificate only from one doctors surgery on Harley Street in London, England, despite not even being in Europe. I have also had to had my whole passport translated, show bank account details and even proof of purchase for my house. Then rights you say, in most of these countries the locals have no rights, let alone the foreigners. How about an AIDS test at the airport or a letter from your employer every time you leave the country, like it is in Yemen? Perhaps a yellow fever certificate to be shown at the airport when leaving and entering the country, maybe that's your cup of tea. How about the Iqarma system in the Mid East? How does that rate on your employee rights which are everywhere but here?

What I am talking to is someone who has been to Germany, been to China and thinks he's seen everything in between.

And go on, do tell, what is it that makes you think I'm an American?

Yes I have done a joint venture here. If you require details then PM me and you can check it all out. The point of a joint venture is that one side cannot function without the other, each knows its role and that's the basis of the business. There is one office wherever dealing with the side of things that the Chinese need assistance with. As I said, PM me.

How it works is that you send your details to your employer, your employer takes care of things this end, sends the required documents to the embassy, you send your docs to the embassy too (not go in person for fingerprints, something else I have had to do) someone puts the docs from you and China together, issues the visa, you pay extra for a 48 hour service, come to China, have a medical, within 30 days show your docs to the PSB who then issue a permit for you. if you know of a country where you all arrange your own work visa without help from an employer, please say so. In my experience this is the basis for any visa, except with varying amounts of BS and extra documents added.

Is this just sour grapes because of the non native speaker work visa situation? I understand if it is.
Just think, if your lot had won the war it would be you, not me, who would be considered the native speaker. You must sit in your dark room cursing Churchill's bones, eh?

I dont know diddly about getting a work visa in China because I do not need to work but I do know that it is very easy to get a visa and live in peace in Cambodia. I have an American friend who lives there with his chinese spouse and he can easily get a 6 month or 1 year visa for both of them without the hassle we have here in China. As a matter of fact, he does not even have to deal with the PSB types, he just hands his passport to an agent and it is all done for him. So yes, getting a visa in Cambodia is much easier than China - especially for chinese who find it very difficult to get more than a 30 day tourist visa to anywhere in the world.

I know many people whose sole purpose for working is NOT money but getting a visa to stay in country. Cambodia is certainly freindly towards anyone who wants to stay long term without having to work. A great option for those who find it difficult to remain in China.

If you are a native English speaker with two years' experience teaching English, with a university degree, and a TESOL certificate, then it is no problem to get a Chinese visa. Why should they make it easy for unqualified people to teach?

That's the decision they've made. I dont agree with it. Someone goes on a weekend TEFL course in Barcelona, gets a certificate that's not worth the paper it's written on, then lands a job teaching English. What they would have been better doing was saying only RSA certified certs would be recognised. Anyone, Greek, Italian or Sudanese, if they pass a CELTA or a Trinity, then it's safe to assume they know the ropes. If it's a DELTA then even more so. I've seen many a non native speaker who knew their way around a board and would put some of these native speaking straight from school gap year waifs and strays to shame.

When I mentioned this to one of the 'big potatoes' at MOE he said, and he has a point, China is full of non native English teachers (The Chinese) if someone has difficulty they can explain the point in English or Chinese, but it was presumed a non native speaker from another country wouldn't be able to deal as well with it. It was a class action instead of a case by case basis, which I supppose when you think of the numbers involved, makes some sense. However, and this is one of the reasons I am here, 50% of these Chinese English teachers are teaching above their levels, in disiplines they don't know, and in some cases to students whose English is better than the teacher. The other point is that, looking at test results for International tests, IELTS, FCE, CAN etc, it's the oral English that Oriental students struggle with, the written and reading sections are fine, better than other non script areas of the world, and it is this that got on the governments radar. They want it fixed with native speakers and is why when you see ads on here it's isually for foreign teachers to teach oral english, that's also how the schools have been told to work by MOE. When I say schools I mean schools not training centres.

Of course there are still ways around the non native speaker rule, but over the course of the next few years teacher numbers will probably go down, especially if they bring in the native speaker plus TEFL plus degree only in English, Linguistics or Education. Another strange one as a degree in English means you can't half dissect a Shakespeare play, but does this help you teach a foreign language class?

@ladyinred back to your original question: if you have a Degree, 2 years experience, a TEFL/TESOL certificate (online courses are available and accepted) it is possible to get a work visa. My advice is to find work in a place which has been around for a while and ask to be put in touch with somebody who is already working there and/or has worked there in the past. Not all the schools can help you get a visa. Working on any other kind of visa is illegal (study, tourist, business...). If you enjoy teaching kids, and if you are a native speaker (or if you are not, but you have a passport from UK, US, Australia, New Z, Canada, Ireland) it will be easy for you to get a job here. If you work for a public school/kindergarden, it will be monday to friday daytime. If you work in a private language school be prepared to work evenings and weekends. Non-native speakers can still get a visa provided they have excellent qualifications and have lived in an English-speaking country for a long time (not sure about the exact details but it's definitely possible!if the school is serious, they will know about those details). You will also need a criminal background check from your country.