"I haven't hijacked anything. I'm posting a lot, but I'm not talking to myself."

Are you sure?

blah blah blah

yawn

I suspect that early TCM feedback was along the lines of; yes! it worked she got better!, or, oops. won't try that again.

Given it was one or two thousand years ago, trial and error plus good notes would work,

"Actually, I think that you don't understand what science is. Science is trial and error. Scientists get ideas, then they experiment on their ideas. Why do you think lab rats exist? For trial and error."

Actually science is a bit more than wild guesses and lab rats. I understand that may be a strech for you.

Actually, Chinese Philosopher Fung Yulan, 冯友兰, in his essay "Why China Has No Science―An Interpretation of the History and Consequences of Chinese Philosophy," explains why China did not have and did not need science. But that is in a book and you need skills other than speedy key tapping to access it.

"Sorry, I'd like to jump in here about this:,,,"

What does this post have to do with anything?

Oh yes

"1) this conversation has been stimulated in large part because of me. a bit of appreciation for that would be nice. not to mention all the other posts where i've tried to provide information."

Thank you so much!

I have used TCM off and on, for one ailment or another for more than 40 years in four different countries including the US. The results have been mixed. The main factors are the TCM practitioner, the ailment being treated, and whatever method of treatment is employed. Some TCM practitioners are quite good, but, in my experience most range from just okay to outright quacks. At the initial evaluation, only three, one in Beijing and two in LA, practitioners quite accurately assessed my past significant medical episodes. Most of them had some idea of my chronic health problems, but a significant number had absolutely no idea, or could not tell, I had had three heart attacks and a stroke. In my judgment, only about one in ten really know, and four of ten have a clue, or guess, correctly. I never returned to be treated by the rest.

TCM is supported and pushed by the Chinese government, purportedly, because of its effectiveness, cultural basis, long history and a sense that the Chinese are biologically different. In fact, as Hugo points out, TCM is cheaper. Providing healthcare to 1.3 billion people is expensive and herbs, roots and bark is a lot cheaper which is important in a poor country. If you tell hundreds of millions of uneducated people that brewing some leaves and stuff, will make you better, and most do get better, there you go, it is effective.

In 2003, the SARS panic struck China. I was teaching at a "university" about 40Km from Beijing. It was unusually warm that spring. The foreign teachers became aware of the SARS problem while China was denying there was a problem. Soon they had to face the fact that a lot of people were getting sick and it appeared China was doing nothing. At first, they tried several TCM solutions; keep windows open, disinfect floors, place carpets in entrances soaked with disinfectant. Rallies and marches to "Fight SARS" were held.

The foreign teachers realized washing hands was important. We bought soap pumps for all the WCs with our own money. I made up "Fight SARS, Wash Your Hands" posters and posted them in the teaching building. The soap was seized and taken away as we didn't have permission to give it to the students. I was ridiculed for my posters and they brought in a "famous TCM Doctor" to educate me as to the causes of SARS (he was from a dump of a hospital 100m down the road). I was repeatedly scorned and derided with "Wash Your Hands" catcalls. When the government found science, they promoted hand washing as a key preventative measure. My posters were immediately torn down and the soap reappeared.

The problem you see, is that TCM, with its Qi balance, hot and cold does not consider things like bacteria and viruses.

About 25% of all SARS victims were employees of TCM hospitals. Most other patients were elderly persons in TCM hospitals or visited sick friends in TCM hospitals. Only about 12% were kids under 12 which was odd as this is usually the age group hardest hit by highly contagious, fast moving diseases.

TCM not only failed to deal with SARS but TCM hospitals were the centers of infection and help spread SARS.

TCM creates a demand for rhino horn. According to the 16th century Chinese pharmacist Li Shi Chen, the horn could also cure snakebites, hallucinations, typhoid, headaches, carbuncles, vomiting, food poisoning, and "devil possession." Pretty good for something essentially like your fingernail.

TCM has been around for, perhaps, 2000 years. Claiming it is based on science just discloses the claimant as ignorant of what science is. Most likely TCM is a coda resulting from 2000 years of trial and error. To claim modern Western doctors prescribe medicines in a trial and error basis is really silly. I don't know how many years a TCM doctor trains but I have seen many under 25 treating patients and doing acupuncture.

It is true that many TCM herbal concoctions, used for centuries can be found in Western pharmacies today, but there is an issue. Herbal efficacy can vary greatly year to year depending on such factors as rainfall, temperature, storage time and preparation method. Working that all out a thousand years ago had to be trial and error.

Complaining about the pharmaceutical industry making money stumps me. Every day I take a bunch of pills. They keep me alive. If there was no profit in making these pills where would I be? Even TCM is a profit driven industry.