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Forums > Study > Learning Chinese Business Practices

So business etiquette and practices don't matter much. We talked to potential partners who like western honesty and direct approach and we met customers, who were all traditional.

It's your gut feeling what will succeed in the end.

@OP
I would say hang out with a nice economics professor or student from a good University and treat them for nice meals and meetings. I did that once and I got some really good advice and ideas, one student even helped me to meet potential investors.

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Forums > Study > Learning Chinese Business Practices

@scouser
No, I am not sure.

But it sounds like you are putting it all on one product.

I think he put Myanmar there as an emerging market and as he put Myanmar at the very bottom of the list [there were still 4 more,- depending on the goods you want to produce], I'd say he is on the same page with you.

According to him, the government is welcoming businesses and breaking their legs to get investments, as it means stability in the long run.

Of course it is an ex-socialist country and thus the paper works is tremendous, as is in China.

When I tried to start my fabrics production line, the government bloke in charge of liaison (in Guangzhou) told me that it would take me about a year to get all my paper work ready, and the amount of stuff we had to prepare, for using organic dye, was more than 13 pages.

The biggest issue, in Myanmar is not bureaucracy but stability.
Anyway it is on the list of emerging markets. EU regulations you can go around, for example assembly in another country. And we did the numbers, producing in Thailand, Vietnam, Myanmar or Sri Lanka, including, shipping, E.U. standards of safety and environmental friendly production, red envelopes, shipping it to HK for print and assembly, it was still cheaper than producing in a run-down, wastewater flushing craphole of a factory, where workers breath in fumes all day long and the quality is still below standard.

It shows how serious he was about China's policies to suck foreign companies and investments dry and using shady business practices, whilst still complaining that foreign investors and politicians are not exactly ecstatic when it comes to their failed business-graves in China.

Anyway, I just think that China is too risky without any securities for companies. You have to give up all your secrets and technology, your contracts don't mean anything, IP does only exists for Chinese gov.-firms, and no state of law.
So in short you cannot win in China.

India is the way to go, especially if you have some IP, that is important to your production and state of the art goods.

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Forums > Study > Learning Chinese Business Practices

Let me say it differently, unless you like gambling or high risk investments, it doesn't matter if you know Chinese business manners and practices, or not.

It is all in the hands of your potential partners.

The potential partner, will display his options and judge you not by the business etiquette but what he or she can use against you, to his advantage.

If you are LUCKY and he is pleased and he personally likes you and you plan, he may cooperate and you have a long and prosperous future, until he doesn't need you anymore and drop you, as you have no real power to win against him in a court. So he can act as he pleases.

Keep him happy!

If you give him a hongbao or not, if you invite an official to a banquette, or not, is not up to your try or effort but how much that person feels, thinks of you, or can benefit from you.

If you are a well planned strategist-business planner, China has too many variables and potential obstacles and risk factors. Even if you have a fantastic product, location is great, distribution network is tip-top, quality is amazing and marketing and sales is top (=an USUALLY fail-safe business plan) the chance to fail is still 50% in China (maybe even higher).

That is why many companies, even the top brands are seriously considering moving away from China,

plus a whole bunch of other major problems.

In terms of business etiquette, I saw loads of owners doing everything right, by Chinese business standards, but they still got axed, or didn't get the bid and that is the more upbeat options, as I said, I have seen my contracts been flushed down the toilet and lawyers telling me, that to win the lawyer battles I don't have the connections or budget.

So as Tiger Tiger stated. Set up a company in the family, get investments from the family as well as any other NEEDS for setting up the business. It's still a high risk by international standards, but much lower, as family is tighter than outsiders.

Usually families have a few rich uncles and aunts trying to evade taxes by investing in start ups and new business ventures.

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Forums > Study > Learning Chinese Business Practices

My buddy told me while working for the EUCC in Beijing, that the unofficial policy for investor recommendation is, NEVER DO BUSINESS IN CHINA.

According to him, he says, they recommend to look into other markets, such as Vietnam, India, Brazil, and Myanmar.

And from my own experience of 5 different forced partnerships and co-operations, who got sabotaged, ruined or just straight stolen, I can only emphasize it.

p.s. I am not talking about opening a food shop, diner or mixian place.
I mean production lines, educations, consulting and design businesses in mid-level. Too big to operate alone as foreign entity, and too small for multi-national corporations.

From what I hear, India is the sh*t, these day. Corruption is cheaper there and actual laws to stick with, you can even win a lawsuit against a local....sounds like luxury to me.

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Forums > Food & Drink > Metro Store South open.

Metro cards work in China nationwide and once, staff even let me in

European store with my card, but I couldn't get some of the billing documents (for obvious reasons VAT, and other taxes)and I dunno if it was just a nice bloke, or if you have access to all stores E.U. wide. Anyway, we got the items we needed. ;)

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So in my opinion.....Go beetle, go! But I think there are dangers as well. When it becomes a big business then all the people in life stock would change and let it become the same rotten business. And I think a few escaped colonies of something after a healthy amount of mutation can kill the same amount of vegetation as they saved....but in minutes.

Is it a great way to balance diet and help nature? ..Sure! but it needs to be handled with care.

About transportation versus life stock fart. It's true (in terms of tons in relation to efficiency) but also because car combustion engine produce greenhouse gas in a quite small amounts (comparitively).

But considering the waste or resources just to produce on damn kilo of meat, is unbelievable and doesn't make sense. From the soil to the chemicals we feed those poor creatures. To mega tax, non-green food would be a good option. There si a lot of fake green food but that is still better than the best non-green food.

Some insects taste good, if you don't eat them in those touristy spots. I had some insects in a proper (local) food place and it wasn't too bad. If you overcome you creeps.

The whole problem is so far progresed that is needs help everywhere, soiltreatment, farming, water treatment, animal food, and most important a change in our minds. If you buy a burger for a US$ (&the prices we expect), you can figure that everything in it is from exploitation of others and the environment.

no!...please...
I love Chinglish! Nothing better on a crappy day, than walking down the streets,
-reading what sort of plants are being raped=park signs,
-what cuelty has been shown to food-in menues,

-or whoever designed those roadsign being drunk and just throwing letters together that looked the most appealing.
I blame it on the baijiu.

I say save Kunming's Chinglish.

You have to love China for it's inefficinecy and stupidety, sometimes.
When I entered Changshui airport the first time I sensed that it's below any international standards,

(hence..not even soap in the washrooms).

Even the old AP was better managed and designed. Like most things in China the package looks great and what you find inside, is rubbish or crappy knockoffs.

Sorry guys you had to go through this, I'm not a fan of airports but I always enjoy Chinese prestige object failing....because there is the only consistency, the only efficiency... efficiency in sucking, with a 99.9% failure rate. :)

bluppfisk
you are absolutely right fog is generally no problem (wind is...as with humans).
There is a CAT scale measuring the fog density and only the CATIIIc requires certain equipment and experience by the pilot and crew. CATIIIc needs autoland sytems (not autopilot) guessing Chinese Airlines don't invest in it...it's quite expensive.

All others are ok to approach and land with ILS... I wasn't there but I sincerely doubt it was CATIIIc that day. Plus usually normal airports have weather reports and are able to reroute in time to avoid what happend to you guys.

Also NORMAL airports have emergency staff...handing out free tea/coffee, soups, blankets, ticket returns and have a relation officer walking around making sure you are, as well as possible. Well, NORMAL airports.

For the cats at China Air Traffic...even rain, the least of all weather problems, brings the new Beijing airport to a complete shutdown. They literally closed all air traffic for as little as heavy rain.

They even have the regulation that there has to be 10 minutes space inbetween take offs in rain.

I guess Chinese airline pilots fly with a compass in their lap and wind speed is measured by licking the finger and hold it out of the window...

Again sorry guys but man I love China for that stuff. Welcome China to the 21st Century and Changshui airport to the 19th, if lucky. Was even reported on CCTV..Great job Kunming!

Reviews

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Disgusting!..Absolutely Disgusting!

We were sick the whole night being dumb enough to eat there.

Plastic flavor, far overpriced 54 kuai for the 2 of the smallest Burger and fries, which were insultingly small for "BIG" fries.

If there were more than 15 fries in there, I would be surprised.
Chicken Burger was almost raw and overloaded with mayonnaise and flavoring.

The whopper tasted like nothing but onion and artificial flavoring.
Burger bun like a puffy ...I don't even know what to compare it to.
What a waste of time and money.

I would almost say it was the worst food i had in the last ten years. Especially having mud-butt and throwing up all night.

At least McD and KFC don't advertise quality and other nonsense, although equally rubbish.

Just terrible!

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Sorry this probably belongs into the forum section...But just to clarify and thanks to overrated reviews I went to CC with high expectations to get some delicacies, I wanted to surprise my wife with a delicacy and there was absolutely nothing that Parkson, Metro or Carrefour don't have.I don't like Chorizo so there has to be more than just that to make me give 5 stars.Plus I already gave them 3 stars, for the very positive things I experienced.There are no products that other shops don't offer, except if their products are home made but I didn't see any labels stating it's organic or home made.For the cold cuts I found as well as the cheeses are all (or most) available at other stores.I didn't know that they make sandwiches and I will give that a try especially knowing that Sandra is involved in the making which usually leads to a yummy tummy.But again as delicacy shop it's very unimpressive and as stated before I believe it will get better. So I am not bashing it but trying to help the owners to give some ideas not just applause because I like Sandra's food...which I do.So I recommend to give realistic reviews. 5 stars just because you like one item there will just disappoint potential CC patrons that are not going for Sandwiches or Chorizo.It's a shop with tons of potential and I will come back to try the Sandwich and see what else they will have in future. But giving more than 3 stars for what I saw wouldn't be fair.

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I went there and all the fake Ikea (furniture) items were almost twice as much as the originals at Ikea. The fixing guys are good but as mentioned above at least need a week or two to drill 4 holes in the wall.

The little knick knacks are ok and reasonably priced. For real furniture, I wouldn't buy there. Better and cheaper options available. But good for cheap and nice decorations and accessories.

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I practiced there for a few weeks but unforntunately I had to stop, due to relocation.
It's a good school but what I didn't like was the Martial Arts blend between traditional kungfu and modern wushu, similar to the Henan one.
But I still like it for the good exercise, staff and classmates.

I am not sure if there are actually some real kungfu monks, so if you are looking for the full martial package, you might get disappointed, as almost anywhere in China.

Be aware that practice is not in the temple but in a kungfu school one block away

That said, it is in my opinion the best choice in Kunming to practice the closest to real martial arts (besides taiji). And it's very reasonably priced.